This topic recently came up in the "Do we have a tag for that" thread. oblivious and related tags have wiki pages, but naive does not. Given the similarity between these tags, I think it is worth delineating what the difference is.

I would argue the difference is that a naive character understands that something is happening but does not understand its implications, while an oblivious character does not understand that anything is happening at all. However, this definition also has overlap with confusion.

Proposed wiki description:

post #158486

This tag refers to situations where at least one character misunderstands or is confused by something that is "adult" in nature (sex, violence, etc.) due to lack of knowledge. This can range from not picking up on context clues, to not understanding that sexual acts are sexual. This can sometimes overlap with oblivious, but while oblivious characters are completely unaware of a situation, naive characters are aware of a situation but unaware of its implications. Commonly portrayed with young characters.

See also

• child_grooming
• deception
• naive_sex
• oblivious
• oblivious_sex
• oblivious_sexualization

(It's really hard to find a good example image; I want a nonsexual one to distinguish it from naive_sex.)

Without reading, my immediate reaction to that question is that naïve is not knowing, and oblivious is being incapable of knowing
At least that's what I would assume the writer's intent would be if they chose one word over the other

It occurs to me that under this definition, most posts currently tagged with oblivious_sexualization would need to be changed to naive.

This is my interpretation of the tags:
naive = a character misunderstands or is confused by something that is "adult" in nature (sex, violence, etc.) due to lack of knowledge
oblivious = a character is completely unaware of the current situation

crocogator said:
This is my interpretation of the tags:
naive = a character misunderstands or is confused by something that is "adult" in nature (sex, violence, etc.) due to lack of knowledge
oblivious = a character is completely unaware of the current situation

yeah this
naive=ignorant
oblivious=unaware

crocogator said:
This is my interpretation of the tags:
naive = a character misunderstands or is confused by something that is "adult" in nature (sex, violence, etc.) due to lack of knowledge
oblivious = a character is completely unaware of the current situation

I like this. I've updated the draft description to use this definition.

Any further notes, or do you think this description is good to go?

beholding said:
Any further notes, or do you think this description is good to go?

Since this has gotten no response in 5 days, I assumed the answer was "yes" and added the description to the wiki.

The tricky part now is disentangling oblivious_sexualization, because under this definition many of the posts within it should actually be considered naive. Should we rename it to "naive sexualization"?

beholding said:
The tricky part now is disentangling oblivious_sexualization, because under this definition many of the posts within it should actually be considered naive. Should we rename it to "naive sexualization"?

Honestly no, just looking at the few example images in that wiki shows that it would require manual separation because some are actually oblivious, like the "Try this flavor, jk it's my penis cumming" meme

nin10dope said:
Honestly no, just looking at the few example images in that wiki shows that it would require manual separation because some are actually oblivious, like the "Try this flavor, jk it's my penis cumming" meme

Should we create a "sexually naive" tag (or some similar name) for the remainder? Given oblivious_sexualization currently has a mere 40 posts, it may be too niche to necessitate a tag.

beholding said:
Should we create a "sexually naive" tag (or some similar name) for the remainder? Given oblivious_sexualization currently has a mere 40 posts, it may be too niche to necessitate a tag.

Reading the wikis for Naïve and Oblivious, I think we should make a BUR to alias these specifications to the single-word tags respectively. Both are not too bloated and the wikis already allude to the explicit nature we're describing. I think it's a case of less-is-more

I've cut oblivious_sexualization down to 10 posts. 6 are on my blacklist. Of the remainder, I think only post #4721523 is clearly distinct from either naive or oblivious_nudity, but it's better described by unaware_hypnosis. I've replaced the wiki page with links to naive and oblivious_nudity, though this can be reversed if a better description is proposed.

I think naive_sex could/should be aliased to naive

nin10dope said:
I think naive_sex could/should be aliased to naive

Why?

beholding said:
Why?

I think it's redundant due to naive's wiki already making it apparent that it's used for adult scenarios. It's very rarely used as well.

nin10dope said:
I think it's redundant due to naive's wiki already making it apparent that it's used for adult scenarios. It's very rarely used as well.

The wiki also says it's used for violent scenarios, not just sexual ones, and there's a difference between sexual scenarios and actual sex.

beholding said:
The wiki also says it's used for violent scenarios, not just sexual ones, and there's a difference between sexual scenarios and actual sex.

I know, but naive sex would actually give more results for what you want because the combo tag is rarely used

nin10dope said:
I know, but naive sex would actually give more results for what you want because the combo tag is rarely used

Oh right, I keep forgetting about combo searches.

I've made a request to alias it away, as you suggest.