The bulk update request #10065 has been rejected.

remove alias shame (0) -> embarrassed (57017)

Reason: Embarrassment involves feeling shame in the presence of another, but shame can be felt internally, such as feeling ashamed of one's thoughts. I believe this warrants a separate tag.

Examples of posts I consider to exhibit shame but not embarrassment:

post #1141758 post #427413 post #3428510

Non-sexual examples can also exist, such as a warrior feeling shame at losing a battle, which I don't think would be appropriately described by "embarrassment".

Edited to add: Additionally, the connotations of the words feel different, at least to me. I consider embarrassment to be a frivolous and momentary thing, while shame is deeper and more serious. I may be off-base on this, but I feel there are cases of shame where "embarrassment" feels like the wrong word to use.

EDIT: The bulk update request #10065 (forum #435177) has been rejected by @Beholding.

post #550630

I don't think there's a significant difference between the two that can fit with TWYS. "Embarrassment" works when someone visibly feels shame.

watsit said:
I don't think there's a significant difference between the two that can fit with TWYS. "Embarrassment" works when someone visibly feels shame.

Public vs. private embarrassment can be distinguished under TWYS. Perhaps they should be renamed as such?

beholding said:
Public vs. private embarrassment can be distinguished under TWYS. Perhaps they should be renamed as such?

Wdym public vs private embarrassment?

leafdapple said:
Wdym public vs private embarrassment?

In the three examples I posted, the character is expressing a sense of shame within their internal monologue, with no other characters present. This is distinct from feeling ashamed in a public situation under the scrutiny of onlookers, which is what I would usually consider "embarrassment" to be.

beholding said:
In the three examples I posted, the character is expressing a sense of shame within their internal monologue, with no other characters present. This is distinct from feeling ashamed in a public situation under the scrutiny of onlookers, which is what I would usually consider "embarrassment" to be.

A character can be embarrassed without onlookers, and they can feel shame with onlookers. Such a distinction between shame (being for a private/internally induced feeling) and embarrassment (being for a public/externally induced feeling) seems arbitrary and easy to mix up.

On reflection, you're right that I can't articulate a clear difference, which is a sign decoupling these is a bad move. "Embarrassment" still feels like the wrong descriptor for these situations, though. Perhaps conflicted is what I'm looking for? I will think on this more. For now, I'll tag the example posts with conflicted and embarrassed.

The bulk update request #10065 (forum #435177) has been rejected by @Beholding.