RAW

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.
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Sorry, I had to.

Anyways, I'm kinda glad I don't upload. This makes things even more complicated. I wish you posters luck...

...inb4 tumblr finds this out and, being tumblr, decides to "fix" it D:

Strongbird
Contributor
5 months ago

Clitheroe said:
...inb4 tumblr finds this out and, being tumblr, decides to "fix" it D:

Tumblr's not a little site by any stretch of the imagination. Heck, it's been purchased by Verizon as part of its new subsidary Oath Inc.

Aside from the obvious conflict of interest (and potential censorship) this will result in, there is very little reason for Verizon to care about a handful of anthro artists complaining that the website stores their data in the resolution they uploaded it in. The onus will continue to fall squarely on artists to upload material in 1280x1920 max -or- go Conditional_DNP on e621 with 'raw' links prohibited to save sub-30-seconds of resizing. The former is the better solution for Patreon resolution paywalls as many other sites will simply not care about takedown requests.


Strongbird said:
it's been purchased by Verizon as part of its new subsidary Oath Inc.

Technically, Verizon glomped Yahoo, which had already glomped Tumblr, so Tumblr's just along for the ride.

Strongbird
Contributor
5 months ago

Strikerman said:
Technically, Verizon glomped Yahoo, which had already glomped Tumblr, so Tumblr's just along for the ride.

Before June 13, 2017, Yahoo was not part of Verizon. Verizon announced they would purchase Yahoo since July 25, 2016, but the deal has not realized until nearly a year later. Now that Verizon owns Yahoo, and by extension Tumblr, they've transferred the Tumblr brand to Oath Inc., a direct subsidiary to Verizon with no influence from Yahoo.

I'll not derail the thread, but I figured I should clarify the situation.


down voted for leaving a comment to try and help the uploader on post #1253972.

normally i wouldn't complain about a few down votes but it also seems odd that, at first, my longer comment there got 2 down votes and after my 2nd comment they BOTH got 2 more down votes which strikes me as rather odd. getting down votes for trying to help someone.


treos said:
down voted for leaving a comment to try and help the uploader on post #1253972.

normally i wouldn't complain about a few down votes but it also seems odd that, at first, my longer comment there got 2 down votes and after my 2nd comment they BOTH got 2 more down votes which strikes me as rather odd. getting down votes for trying to help someone.

Welcome to the bastion of intelligence that is the e621 userbase.


Ratte said:
Welcome to the bastion of intelligence that is the e621 userbase.

discord_(mlp) draconequus eyewear friendship_is_magic humor insane male mini_top_hat monocle my_little_pony peachiekeenie what_has_science_done

Rating: Safe
Score: 5
User: ErosThanatos
Date: March 04, 2013

-_- best description of internet. even better than NMNY's "stop taking the internet so seriously" post.

i'm actually a little surprised i remembered this specific post but then again, it's kinda hard to forget that particular type of person that discord is.


I wish I would have known this YEARS ago! MY WHOLE LIFE HAS BEEN A LIE!

Honestly though I noticed long ago that you could change the 1280 to a 540 and get a smaller size...so I knew that was the secret to getting the original size. I seriously tried so many words there: original, orig, high, highest, hires, highres...no dice. To think that "raw" was the magic word and I never found it...ARGH >.<


Dyrone said:
I wish I would have known this YEARS ago! MY WHOLE LIFE HAS BEEN A LIE!

Honestly though I noticed long ago that you could change the 1280 to a 540 and get a smaller size...so I knew that was the secret to getting the original size. I seriously tried so many words there: original, orig, high, highest, hires, highres...no dice. To think that "raw" was the magic word and I never found it...ARGH >.<

Now that you've mentioned it, I'm really curious as to how this was discovered in the first place. Was someone experimenting with urls like yourself and just got lucky? Was it a leak from someone working with Tumblr? Or did someone just dig into the site's mess of an API and find what was overlooked by everyone else for the past half-decade?


Dyrone said:
I wish I would have known this YEARS ago! MY WHOLE LIFE HAS BEEN A LIE!

Honestly though I noticed long ago that you could change the 1280 to a 540 and get a smaller size...so I knew that was the secret to getting the original size. I seriously tried so many words there: original, orig, high, highest, hires, highres...no dice. To think that "raw" was the magic word and I never found it...ARGH >.<

I tried different combos too back then, but it didn't occur to me to try (it) raw.


DelurC said:
I tried different combos too back then, but it didn't occur to me to try (it) raw.

lol, it never occurred to me that the original size would be publicly available (or stored anywhere on tumblr's servers)
i thought tumblr would create the 500 / 540 / 1280 versions and discard the original image
with the uploader being responsible for keeping the original version on his hard disk, in case he needed it again later


treos said:
down voted for leaving a comment to try and help the uploader on post #1253972.

normally i wouldn't complain about a few down votes but it also seems odd that, at first, my longer comment there got 2 down votes and after my 2nd comment they BOTH got 2 more down votes which strikes me as rather odd. getting down votes for trying to help someone.

Downvotes tend to snowball here, pay them no mind


Oh dear, guys. (TEXT WALL AHEAD)

▼ A PROBLEM...

Some people, as a method of getting more patrons on their patreon, post images on tumblr because it would scale it down, and they have the hig res version on patreon.

But as we discovered... All you have to do is add the "raw" at the end, and BAM - High res version.

People are already sending takedown forms and generally bitching. People are too dependent on tumblr resizing, and it'll be unavoidable to stop people from getting the high res now.

So, what the hell do we do now? This is a rather unexpected consequence...


Clitheroe said:
Oh dear, guys. (TEXT WALL AHEAD)

▼ A PROBLEM...

Some people, as a method of getting more patrons on their patreon, post images on tumblr because it would scale it down, and they have the hig res version on patreon.

But as we discovered... All you have to do is add the "raw" at the end, and BAM - High res version.

People are already sending takedown forms and generally bitching. People are too dependent on tumblr resizing, and it'll be unavoidable to stop people from getting the high res now.

So, what the hell do we do now? This is a rather unexpected consequence...

we ask


Clitheroe said:
Oh dear, guys. (TEXT WALL AHEAD)

▼ A PROBLEM...

Some people, as a method of getting more patrons on their patreon, post images on tumblr because it would scale it down, and they have the hig res version on patreon.

But as we discovered... All you have to do is add the "raw" at the end, and BAM - High res version.

People are already sending takedown forms and generally bitching. People are too dependent on tumblr resizing, and it'll be unavoidable to stop people from getting the high res now.

So, what the hell do we do now? This is a rather unexpected consequence...

In all honesty, I expected it. I even said it to another user in IRC. Give people a tool, and they'll use it... regardless of how it's meant to be used. Second verse, same as the first when raw tumblr was found out.

I can't tell us what we can do, but I suggest asking artists if it's OK to post X resolution images from Y account (site). Be really clear, hold their hands through the process, because in my experiences artists tend to be quick to judge negatively on actions they do not understand.


Clitheroe said:
Oh dear, guys. (TEXT WALL AHEAD)

that's not a text wall. my posts in the video game thread, those are text walls. :P

but yeah, kinda predictable.


Perhaps warn artists about this...

...I never thought I'd suggest warning artists about how people can view their images in original resolution now, what with everyone on tumblr complaining about the resizing... You can never make anyone happy.


Clitheroe said:
So, what the hell do we do now? This is a rather unexpected consequence...

Wait for more takedown requests.

It wasn't really unexpected for anyone who bothered to think about it. This whole re-upload craze however showed that the core people on the site apparently have no idea what they are doing, what the purpose and the goal of the site is.


So basically what this means is the literal tens of thousands of images I have saved in the 1280 form are now obsolete, and I'm going to have to spend the next several years tracking down and replacing every single one with the superior versions.

Great...


Siral_Exan said:
In all honesty, I expected it. I even said it to another user in IRC. Give people a tool, and they'll use it... regardless of how it's meant to be used. Second verse, same as the first when raw tumblr was found out.

I can't tell us what we can do, but I suggest asking artists if it's OK to post X resolution images from Y account (site). Be really clear, hold their hands through the process, because in my experiences artists tend to be quick to judge negatively on actions they do not understand.

My experience is usually the opposite. "I have no idea what this e621 thing is, but if you're crediting me sure!", maybe with "as long as you aren't profiting from it" but not so commonly a no.


Furrin_Gok said:
My experience is usually the opposite. "I have no idea what this e621 thing is, but if you're crediting me sure!", maybe with "as long as you aren't profiting from it" but not so commonly a no.

I applaud those artists' optimism. I guess it could be contextual, I've asked artists whom draw comics or shorts, more of the prior than the latter; the latter being the ones who say "OK", but I usually have to (re)specify what I'm uploading to get that answer.


Clitheroe said:
Oh dear, guys. (TEXT WALL AHEAD)

▼ A PROBLEM...

Some people, as a method of getting more patrons on their patreon, post images on tumblr because it would scale it down, and they have the hig res version on patreon.

But as we discovered... All you have to do is add the "raw" at the end, and BAM - High res version.

People are already sending takedown forms and generally bitching. People are too dependent on tumblr resizing, and it'll be unavoidable to stop people from getting the high res now.

So, what the hell do we do now? This is a rather unexpected consequence...

That's pretty low amount of text for wall. Trump would be dissapoint.

Educate artists. They can and are free to even use our takedown system, but just getting rid of copies in here doesn't make them vanish from source and everyone can just go and get the content regardless. Make them aware of these kind of things, instead of trying to be stealthy and hoping they don't notice. They deserve and are supposed to know. Artist simply seeing high resolution files floating around makes them think content has leaked instead of they themselves serving it.

Not understanding something always puts you in defensive mode by default and if it seems like something bad then of course you want to shoot first, then ask and solve things later if there's someone alive.

This is also the reason why we handle _raw like any other source, because it's still source that's publicly freely available and provided by artist themselves. This is also exactly the same way we handle all other sources already, I think most notabely includes twitters :orig files, so it would be pointless to handle tumblr differendly.

Tell artists to downscale content beforehand by themselves if they do not want higher resolutions to be public, especially if they try to monetize from them. Excluding furaffinity which sucks, most sites do save original file regardless if it's served to regular users or not. And if including furaffinity into the mix, downscaling content yourself before sending quarantees higher actual quality when sending to websites as sometimes sites use downscaling methods not optimal for the artwork and FA even JPG compressing too large images (FA large = actually medium/low sized images).

Siral_Exan said:
I can't tell us what we can do, but I suggest asking artists if it's OK to post X resolution images from Y account (site). Be really clear, hold their hands through the process, because in my experiences artists tend to be quick to judge negatively on actions they do not understand.

Problem here is that we prefer superior versions here, meaning that if one user asks nicely and gets permission to only post from site X and not Y, if other user does go and upload better version from site Y which is freely publicly available, that version is preferred and first persons post is deleted.

In similar way, if source or even image itself states "do not repost" somewhere, we do not take that into account with approvals. User saying that artist isn't allowing posting from site Y changes nothing and artist themselves are required to use our takedown and/or apply for DNP.


Mario69 said:
Problem here is that we prefer superior versions here, meaning that if one user asks nicely and gets permission to only post from site X and not Y, if other user does go and upload better version from site Y which is freely publicly available, that version is preferred and first persons post is deleted.

In similar way, if source or even image itself states "do not repost" somewhere, we do not take that into account with approvals. User saying that artist isn't allowing posting from site Y changes nothing and artist themselves are required to use our takedown and/or apply for DNP.

Those problems occur regardless of my suggestion. My suggestion aids against prior takedowns, not the unavoidable ones.


I mean, yeah, the site demands we get a superior version if it's FREELY available... Which raw images are.

But now we're gonna have to start getting the purposely crappy quality versions (even though we can VERY EASILY grab the better version) just because an artist says so?

I'm not trying to disrespect artists at all, I mean they gotta make money somehow, but that kind of seems a little too unrealistic. And people are going to constantly reupload the raw version, no matter how many times it gets taken down, because that's just what you're supposed to do on this site.

(sorry if I sound drunkish, I took some nyquil because insomnia's a bitch)


Clitheroe said:
I mean, yeah, the site demands we get a superior version if it's FREELY available... Which raw images are.

But now we're gonna have to start getting the purposely crappy quality versions (even though we can VERY EASILY grab the better version) just because an artist says so?

I'm not trying to disrespect artists at all, I mean they gotta make money somehow, but that kind of seems a little too unrealistic. And people are going to constantly reupload the raw version, no matter how many times it gets taken down, because that's just what you're supposed to do on this site.

(sorry if I sound drunkish, I took some nyquil because insomnia's a bitch)

Artist's wishes are always honored. Pretty simple really; nothing I've seen has contradicted that yet.


Clitheroe said:
I'm not trying to disrespect artists at all, I mean they gotta make money somehow, but that kind of seems a little too unrealistic. And people are going to constantly reupload the raw version, no matter how many times it gets taken down, because that's just what you're supposed to do on this site.

Not if the artists request the "_raw" version of pictures to be added to the DNP list. Artists can request that certain sites and type of artwork can be excluded from being uploaded (resulting in "conditional_dnp"). I don't see why Tumblr "_raw" images can't be given the same treatment without excluding all Tumblr uploads.

Strongbird
Contributor
5 months ago

Friendly request: Please include at least both a link to the Tumblr post the image originated from and direct image URL.

Given only the former, it's not feasible to salvage the original high resolution image if the post is ever deleted, and it's harder to rule out posts whose highest resolutions has already been found (such as both 1280 and raw at 1280x1920).

Given only the latter, it's not easy to find the original Tumblr post, and reverse searches to do so often don't work well. Lack of accreditation to the artist and other metadata (year, for instance) is a sad omission to see in a tag list that is also harder to rectify with just an image link.

With both, all those issues are avoided--people can see where you sourced the image from, it's easier to rule out when searching for more images to replace in better quality, and we can salvage images from being lost to time if blogs or posts are ever deleted.

That is all, thank you.

Genjar
Former Staff
5 months ago
2011 annoyed antennae arthropod biped black_markings blue_eyes clear_membrane clothed clothing crossed_arms cute duo feral front_view green_body human insect insect_wings lifting lol_comments male mammal markings moth nisimawari pellucid_hawk_moth portrait quadruped shirt shorts simple_background solo_focus spread_wings standing three-quarter_portrait three-quarter_view traditional_media_(artwork) watercolor_(artwork) white_background wings

Rating: Safe
Score: 250
User: Genjar
Date: May 29, 2013

There's now likely a lot of deleted thumbnails in the wiki. No way to actually search for those as far as I know, so that'll take a while to fix..

(When fixing those, try to keep the post rating as low as possible. Safe-rated are preferred, so those can be viewed on e926. Personally, I also try to pick low post IDs. Since those are less likely to be taken down.)

Edit: Never mind. I checked them all. Might've accidentally skipped a page or two, but most deleted thumbnails should be replaced now.

leomole
Privileged
5 months ago
2014 anthro bottle bottomless cat chair clothed clothing computer desk feline fur girly headphones hoodie inside jailbird leaning leaning_back legwear liam looking_at_viewer looking_back male mammal reclining sitting smile socks solo tan_fur

Rating: Safe
Score: 117
User: Onii-chan
Date: May 09, 2014

UnusualParadox said:
Not if the artists request the "_raw" version of pictures to be added to the DNP list. Artists can request that certain sites and type of artwork can be excluded from being uploaded (resulting in "conditional_dnp"). I don't see why Tumblr "_raw" images can't be given the same treatment without excluding all Tumblr uploads.

This has already been done (takedown #6186). If an artist wants to take down all raw posts but leave the 1280 versions it's a lot of work for the mods but they'll do it.